Continuing Studies: for Higher Ed Podcasters

[00:00:00] Hannah Mendlowitz: You mentioned Varsity Blues, which happened right before we decided to do this podcast. And our decision to do the podcast was totally connected to that. We, you know, wanted, we realized that we had to find a new way to be a little bit more transparent about what it is that we do. And this felt like the right way to do that.
[00:00:22] Neil McPhedran: Welcome to Continuing Studies. A podcast for higher education podcasters to learn and get inspired. I'm Neil McPhedran.
[00:00:29] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: And I'm Jennifer-Lee. We want you to know you're not alone. In fact, there are many of you higher ed podcasters out there and we can all learn from each other.
[00:00:37] Neil McPhedran: That's right. Before we jump into this episode, we just want to please remind you to follow our Continuing Studies page on LinkedIn.
[00:00:47] Okay, Jen, I'm really excited for this conversation we're having today. Today we are chatting with Mark Dunn and Hannah Mendlowitz from Inside the Yale Admissions Office podcast.
[00:00:59] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: I'm really excited about this one because I have been listening to them and I feel like I could get into Yale now. And I just think their whole approach on giving like a peek behind the curtain about how admissions work for Ivy League schools is amazing. Because I know we get into it, but I just feel that like any movies I watched or anything, I feel like it's a scary situation. It's like people in a dark room grading your essays and like saying, no, they can get in or no, they can't.
[00:01:31] But, uh, we find out that it's actually a very pleasant process and they get snacks, they're allowed to eat. They're not starved while making a decision. So that makes me happy because I also thought that's why they're like, make ruthless decisions.
[00:01:44] Neil McPhedran: I think this is a great example of how higher education can use podcasting in such a smart way to give insights for, uh, that admissions process. And yep, this is a great conversation. So let's just get into it.
[00:02:02] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: We're demystifying the admissions process. Let's start.
[00:02:08] Neil McPhedran: Welcome Hannah and Mark.
[00:02:10] Mark Dunn: Thanks for having us.
[00:02:11] Hannah Mendlowitz: Thank you.
[00:02:12] Neil McPhedran: Okay. So before we jump into talking about Inside Yale Admissions, why don't you tell us a little bit about what your quote unquote day jobs are? So that might just give us a little bit of context into the podcast itself as well.
[00:02:23] Hannah Mendlowitz: Sure. So Hannah here. Um, we, Mark and I are both full time admissions officers at Yale. We are Senior Associate Directors of Admission and we each have our own kind of specialties within the office. I manage our entire first year application process. So everything from, you know, processing the applications that come in, deciding who on our staff is reading what applications, the whole reading committee selection process. That all kind of falls under my, my area. I'm also, you know, an admissions officer with an admissions territory. And I cover parts of Africa, parts of Europe, and New Zealand.
[00:03:04] Mark Dunn: And I am the Director of Outreach and Recruitment. What that means at Yale is that I'm in charge of all the work that we do to communicate with prospective students, primarily students who are sort of juniors and seniors in high school, encouraging them to include Yale with their college application list.
[00:03:21] And then after we have a group of students who is admitted, we do our recruitment work, which is convincing them to choose Yale over their other good options. Um, I also have an admissions territory, I think for both Hannah and me, we know that we could fill our days with our other work. But we love the process of just reading applications, going through the admissions committee, making decisions with our colleagues. Um, that's the core of the work and I think we both like that more than anything else that we do.
[00:03:45] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yep.
[00:03:46] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: Because it's such a lengthy process to get into Yale, is it a lengthy process to get a job in the admissions department?
[00:03:53] Mark Dunn: Oh, interesting question. So Hannah and I are both Yale College graduates. For both of us, this was our first job after graduating. I think for both of us, too, we entered it not sure if it would be what we would stick with.
[00:04:06] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yep.
[00:04:06] Mark Dunn: But quickly found that we enjoyed it. I would say about half of our staff are people who are graduates of Yale. The other half are folks who typically have experience in admissions, uh, somewhere else. But, you know, it is, uh, like we like to describe the undergraduate learning environment here. It's definitely richer by having a diverse collection of personalities and backgrounds and interests. And you want a good mix of people in the room when you're making admissions decisions. So we sort of try to deliberately have a pretty diverse staff along a whole bunch of different dimensions as well.
[00:04:35] Neil McPhedran: That's great. Okay. So maybe tell us a little bit about Inside Yale Admissions and you have an interesting reason for being, I think, as well.
[00:04:44] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah. So this podcast was conceived by Mark, uh, back in early 2020, January, 2020 ish. Mark kind of pitched it to me as, you know, just fun, new, exciting project and a new way to communicate with prospective applicants, parents, counselors. And I distinctively remember kind of like rolling my eyes and saying like, ugh, podcast, everyone thinks they can have a podcast. Do we really need to add our voices to that? But he talked me into it and I'm glad he did because it's been a really fun project and it's been cool to kind of like see how it has evolved from that initial stage.
[00:05:20] Mark Dunn: Yeah, we really wanted to kind of channel the curiosity that people have about a process that is, you know, in our opinion, legitimately really interesting, it's fascinating. We understand why people write lots of articles about it, why they gossip about it, why they're intrigued about it. And people typically tend to imagine that it's sort of shrouded in secrecy and it's filled with all kinds of stuff we don't want you to know. And the truth is that it's just simply kind of complex and that if you were to ask us politely, we would gladly tell you, you know, pretty much everything about, about our work. But because it's interesting, it is, and because it's complex, it takes a while to unpack it.
[00:05:56] Hannah Mendlowitz: Hmm-hmm.
[00:05:56] Mark Dunn: I will say we were interested in the medium of podcasting and it's definitely proven to be valuable. Because it just allows us to speak candidly in a way that is honestly more efficient than like writing things down on a webpage that people may or may not read. We also really liked that it humanizes us at well, as well.
[00:06:16] You know, we want people to understand that there are real people on the other side of the process. That's just like a core piece of advice to prospective students is remember that this is a humane process. It's the one that involves real people and you will be a better college applicant if you think about real people reviewing your application than if you just think that you have to, you know, score a certain number of points on a rubric. So it sort of helps to show and reflect our own selection process really naturally, we think as well.
[00:06:44] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: We definitely have misconceptions. Like when I met you guys, I was like, oh, they're so young. Like, that's not what I would think. And you're friendly and you're nice and you're not wearing suits and you're not like mean. Because I always think about, and it's kind of an old movie reference, but I grew up with it, was Legally Blonde.
[00:07:02] Mark Dunn: Yup.
[00:07:02] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: And when they go to the Harvard admissions and they pan over to the camera, it's all older men that were probably sixty and over with glasses. And they're like, do we let this girl in? And that's what I thought the admissions process was like, but I was shocked. I listened to your episode and you guys make a full day and it seems like fun and you actually get snacks too. Like I just figured they don't feed you. And then that's why you're grumpy admitting everybody.
[00:07:28] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah. I mean, first of all, I appreciate that because out of date movie references are a huge part of our podcast and how we get points across. So, uh, that is on brand, but yeah, I think we meet students all the time who have kind of a similar response who say like, oh, I didn't realize until I listened to the podcast that there were like cool, friendly people who work in admissions.
[00:07:50] Mark Dunn: Yes. And so part of this is definitely kind of, you know, just image sort of management for us, right? Like we, we want people to have a more accurate sense of us for our own sake. But we also think we're doing a public service to people out there by helping them have the correct vision of the people who are in the room.
[00:08:06] I think your application is going to be worse if you're imagining the, uh, legally blonde committee room. I think you actually put together a better application if you imagine folks like Hannah and me reading your application and talking about it in committee.
[00:08:19] Neil McPhedran: That's a really good point. That's a, I think that's a fantastic insight about the podcast and, um, you're right about the process. It's great to humanize who's on the other end of those applications because, um, you know, there's a lot of work that goes into them. So maybe that's a good next question then. Who is the audience? It's not just students, correct?
[00:08:42] Hannah Mendlowitz: Mm hmm. Yeah. I mean, students definitely are, I would say, at the forefront of our mind when we're thinking about episode content. But we also know we have a lot of parent listeners. We have a lot of, uh, school counselors who are listeners as well. Um, and I would say it's not just folks who are interested in applying to Yale. We do hear from people who say, oh, you know, Yale isn't really on my radar as a college, but I found listening to the podcast really helpful as I was, you know, thinking about my other college options. So, um, yeah, it's definitely a pretty broad audience, I would say.
[00:09:14] Mark Dunn: Yeah, the only group I would add to that is, um, reporters as well. You know, for better and for worse, the Yale admissions process gets a lot of attention from media outlets. We get a lot of interview requests. And it's very helpful when we can actually point reporters to, um, lengthy comments that we've already provided in a podcast episode where there's already a transcript. And we basically say, take a look at this. We've already laid it out for you.
[00:09:37] Hannah Mendlowitz: Hmm-mm.
[00:09:38] Mark Dunn: We don't need to put together a written statement or have a whole interview to get you really good insights that are probably more complex and, you know, complete than we might get in just a quick Q and A session.
[00:09:48] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: Yeah. I would just assume that a lot of parents, like you did mention Hannah, are listening because as we all know, and you see it in movies too, and in the news, parents can be really intense when it comes to wanting their kids to go to an Ivy League foot school. And of course we had that whole Varsity Blues scandal, which I don't think paints all parents with a great light. And that's what I think too, is the other part of a mission. So I just imagine parents like trying anything to get them in because there's also, they say they're legit business.
[00:10:20] They were just on the Today Show and they help coach kids to get in. They're kind of like a tutor for like the final years of your education. And parents will pay them a hundred and twenty thousand a year to get them into Yale, to get them into Harvard. And this just fascinates me. Do you find that's kind of a put off for you guys on that podcast? Or do you think it's something that you welcome and you'd rather like educate people and be like, no, actually this is how you should be doing it?
[00:10:52] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah. I mean, a little bit of both. I think our dream would be to make those folks completely obsolete, charging that much money, because honestly, you know, we don't think that they are providing any information that we are not providing for completely for free on the podcast. So that's really one kind of big goal of this is to sort of democratize that information about how the process works and make it accessible to anyone at, you know, no cost.
[00:11:18] Mark Dunn: Yeah, I always explain to folks, the process is just by its nature opaque. We make decisions by sitting in a room and talking about the, you know, sometimes intimate details of a student's life that they've provided in their application. Like we can't just bring in cameras and show everyone what that looks like for every single one of our applicants.
[00:11:37] But in that space rush a whole bunch of opportunists who, you know, frankly, in my opinion, are selling a whole bunch of snake oil. And so, you know, for a long time, I think our approach was simply just like, kind of, well, you know, don't pay attention to them, you know, do our best to provide resources.
[00:11:53] But, you know, because the process, it is complex. It is opaque. We really felt like there's an opportunity for us to provide a free public service and we will, you know, want to say over and over again, essentially like get your information directly from the source. You're not going to find anyone more knowledgeable or reliable with their information than the two of us who have absolutely no personal financial stake in providing this kind of information and sort of, you know, think about that first.
[00:12:19] So we like that it would hopefully discourage some folks from, you know, sort of being tempted to buy those services. We also really hope that it helps those families who just know, well, we could never afford any of that to feel confident that they aren't behind. They aren't missing something. They aren't disadvantaged in our process. We've given them everything that they need to know.
[00:12:41] Hannah Mendlowitz: You mentioned Varsity Blues, which, you know, happened right before we decided to do this podcast and our decision to do the podcast was totally connected to that. We, you know, wanted, we realized that we had to find a new way to be a little bit more transparent about what it is that we do. And this felt like the right way to do that.
[00:12:59] Neil McPhedran: We do a cold open on our podcast. I think we just got it right there. I like that one. That's a good, pull quote there, Hannah. I like that. So as we are a, um, a podcast for higher education podcasters, maybe we'll just sort of ask some more in the weeds questions here then.
[00:13:17] Your job definitely has a crescendo, a period I would imagine, and we're just in it, or we're just coming through it right now, which is why we're really excited to have you on at this time. But is your podcast seasonal, or are you actually running episodes year-round?
[00:13:31] Mark Dunn: Pretty much year-round. We haven't broken anything into seasons. We haven't kept ourselves to a really regular schedule.
[00:13:38] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah.
[00:13:39] Mark Dunn: Uh, we aim for about once a month ish, but sometimes we'll do a flurry, and we'll do, you know, two or three episodes at a time.
[00:13:47] Hannah Mendlowitz: Mm-Hmm.
[00:13:47] Mark Dunn: Sometimes we'll go long stretches where we're in reading and committee season, we kind of know we can't record. Sometimes we need a break.
[00:13:53] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah.
[00:13:53] Mark Dunn: In committee season we say, hey, let's take, you know, a few hours and record a podcast. So, um, no, there's not much of a rhythm to it. The only thing we've done is, you know, some sort of time sensitive things. We've had great fun with live events when we have admitted students on campus, many of whom, you know, are fans, and, um, and, uh, we actually tap into their collective wisdom to pass on to future groups of applicants.
[00:14:14] And then this past fall, we did some fun things where we did some live Q and A sessions for prospective students. And we made it into a virtual event and said, hey, it's September, we know that you're starting to think about college applications. If you're stuck on this particular question or if you just heard this rumor, and you want to you know us to let you know this is a myth or not, bring your MythBuster questions to us and we'll answer them in a live event, and then we'll turn it around and push it out as a podcast episode a couple days later.
[00:14:41] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: And do you find your content limiting though? Because like, how much is there to know about admissions once you talk about it? Or do you find that it's ever changing? Because are you guys actually changing your criteria every year? Or is it like been the same for the last twenty years?
[00:14:57] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah, I would say, I mean, the criteria sort of overall doesn't necessarily change. I will say we don't run out of things to talk about because there's always, yeah, you know, we've done an entire episode on like how students list their extracurricular activities on their application. And we could probably like do a series of three more episodes and not run out of things to talk about on that one subject.
[00:15:20] We do see changes in our process. So, for example, for the application cycle, we are changing our standardized testing policy. We're going from being test optional back to requiring standardized testing. And we recorded three episodes just about that decision. What the new policy is, you know, advice for students as they are thinking about applying with this new policy in place. So there's definitely new things that come up that give us a great reason to record a new episode.
[00:15:47] Mark Dunn: Yeah, favorite story I'll pass along. A few weeks ago, an admissions officer colleague let me know that they had received what we call a duty call. And a duty call just means someone has called the office with a question.
[00:15:57] And we rotate around who's responsible for answering the phones on any given day during the month. And they, uh, the caller had left a message and said, hey, I've got a bunch of questions about your new standardized testing policy. Can you get back to me? The officer called back a couple hours later when they were back at their desk. And the person said, oh, actually, I don't have any questions anymore. I found the podcast and listened to all three episodes. And yeah, that's all my questions. And I was like, yes, that is exactly what we want.
[00:16:23] Neil McPhedran: That's great. I mean, I think that's, what's really interesting about your podcast is, and sort of, kind of back to my question of, is it seasonal? Or do you go every second week or every week or whatever? It's almost a moot question because of the uniqueness of your content. So much of it I would imagine is really evergreen. And you could, if you're top of the funnel of, of picking your schools, if you will, this is what's great about your podcast.
[00:16:46] I can probably go back a couple of seasons here and just, just start picking away at episodes and topics and things like, you know, and things like that.
[00:16:55] Mark Dunn: Yeah, we've tried to be careful with the content to make it evergreen, standardized testing was one of these things. We started the podcast and I had imagined actually our third episode and our initial plan in January of 2020 was going to be about standardized testing because we just get so many questions about it. And we like, it's one of these things where you want to do a paradigm reset just with an audience that doesn't really always get it.
[00:17:17] And instead, our third episode was about how COVID 19 was, you know, throwing a monkey wrench into everything. And it was really four years from then to now, between when we had a new kind of permanent standardized testing policy. And so we just simply didn't talk about standardized test scores. Like, it was this sort of, conspicuously absent topic that we knew we wouldn't get to until we had a more permanent policy. So we were excited to like finally say all the things
[00:17:42] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah, right.
[00:17:43] Mark Dunn: We wanted to say about it so many years later.
[00:17:46] Hannah Mendlowitz: Right.
[00:17:46] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: Is there a topic you haven't done yet that you're both itching to do? Is there something that you want to unveil that maybe you're not sure yet, if you can?
[00:17:54] Mark Dunn: That's a good question.
[00:17:56] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah, that is a good question. One thing we haven't really talked about at all is like athletic recruiting.
[00:18:02] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: That's a whole other thing.
[00:18:02] Hannah Mendlowitz: I think that is, uh, you know,
[00:18:05] Mark Dunn: Yeah.
[00:18:05] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah, exactly. That's a big one that we haven't tackled yet. We also, we have like a podcast email address that we plug at the end of every episode to, you know, ask for requests for topics for future episodes. And I think some of the most common ones are, uh, our international student listeners, you know, would like an episode that's geared towards international students, which if you have listened to our podcast, you know, that every bit of advice we give applies to students, regardless of where they're applying to, so. But that's one we're thinking about doing in the future.
[00:18:41] Mark Dunn: Yeah. I will say two things. Um, first is that we try to come up with just creative fun ideas. Like we did an episode called Lingo Bingo where we made a little game show.
[00:18:50] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah.
[00:18:51] Mark Dunn: Uh, you know, out of just the language and vocabulary of college admissions. So I've got a part of my brain that's always thinking about little things like that. The other category of things is things that we didn't expect that come up in the news and by the same way that we get a lot of media inquiries about our process, people tend to think about us when something in the news happens that's related to admission.
[00:19:11] So this past summer, there was a lot of buzz about ChatGPT and large language models and AI and what that's going to mean for college application essays. I was actually initially reluctant to dive into it. And then the more that I talked with folks around, um, just admissions and with Hannah, we said, you know what?
[00:19:29] Actually, let's get in front of it. Let's do an episode about this, let's make it timely.
[00:19:32] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah.
[00:19:33] Mark Dunn: And again, try to paradigm reset because if we don't actually talk about it now, proactively, this whole sort of incorrect model of just how the process works vis a vis application essays is going to sit in. We're going to be sort of on the defensive about it, not convincing anyone about it. Let's get this out there quickly. It happened to be really well timed, we recorded it, got it out right before the New York Times was doing a whole sort of, um, special section about AI and focusing on college admissions and they came to us questions. We said, oh, hey, guess what? We just recorded this podcast.
[00:20:05] Hannah Mendlowitz: Right.
[00:20:05] Mark Dunn: Go check it out. It was fabulous, not only because they got easy quotes, but also they then linked to the podcast in their article. So we could, you know, direct people right to the content that we'd already recorded. The other big one was the Supreme Court decision, uh, here in the US in June that changed how colleges can consider students, race, and ethnicity in the process. It created a lot of anxiety and confusion. And I was, I will put a shout out to our office of general counsel who was really supportive actually, in our efforts to talk about this in our friendly, straightforward, non-lawyerly way on the podcast to help give some reassurance and some clarity around a topic that had really, provoked a lot of anxiety for our students and certainly parents as well.
[00:20:48] Neil McPhedran: Both those are really good examples of why every admissions office should have a podcast because you've already had it and you were already going, you already had a system, you already had a way, like both those things came up and you're, let's talk about this on our podcast. And it was, it's a channel. Uh, to, you know, it's a, it must be in, you guys must feel like it's very much an invaluable channel now that you've got it up and going and you're, and you have your way to sort of connect with the prospective students, etcetera.
[00:21:19] Mark Dunn: Totally. And I'll just say, like, compared to other communication things we put together, print publications, websites, even email campaigns, podcasts is quick.
[00:21:26] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yes.
[00:21:27] Mark Dunn: Like, it is. From writing it to producing it to getting it out to the world. It is quick, it's easy, it's fun. And, um, yes, I would agree with all that. I've found it very, very just useful, uh, over the past four years since we started.
[00:21:41] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: But podcast really is like the new press release. And that's the thing I'm finding in Canada is like, if you have a podcast for an organization, for a school, if something's going on, it's way easier for somebody to grab clips, grab the soundbites of the expert and write it in a post being like, oh, I'm going to go through these twenty press releases. And I don't know what's interesting or not.
[00:22:03] And they're like twelve car washes. And I don't want to talk about that. But here's something interesting. So that's the thing is people have a weird thing about the word podcast because everyone's talking about it right now. And so I know, especially with colleges and universities, some people love it and they get it.
[00:22:18] And then other people are like, oh, well, I don't want to do a podcast because everyone else is doing it. But it's like, no, they're not. It's not just about you speaking. It's used as a huge marketing tool that can really help you and, uh, feed into all those things that you're doing. Can feed into online writing, can feed into traditional media sources, they all work together. So it's really, you're working smarter, not harder. And I expect that from people that went to Yale.
[00:22:42] Neil McPhedran: Yeah, that's a good point, Jen. And I think that that is also the uniqueness about podcasts. If you sort of think about it. And even just a niche audience, niche audience is totally fine. It doesn't have to be this big audience. And it, as I was joking, every admissions office should have a podcast because each school is unique. And I think this is a way to see inside what the process is for, for admissions into Yale. And I think that's what, you know, that's why it's not like you're competing with another school that's doing a podcast or whatever. It's, um, you know, there's definitely a very valuable reason for being there. So, um, maybe just sort of, again, sort of digging into, again, our niche audience, which is higher education podcasters. Is it just the two of you that do this thing or tell us a little bit about your team and what sort of support do you have? And, uh, would other admissions officers thinking of doing this need to think about?
[00:23:38] Hannah Mendlowitz: Sure. So it's, uh, mostly just the two of us, although almost every episode we try to have a third guest on who's usually another admissions officer. We're very aware that, you know, Mark and I can ramble on and on and on. And it's probably good to break up the sound of our voices with some other voices in the mix as well.
[00:23:56] So we, uh, we try to include, you know, everyone in our office. Almost everyone has been, um, a guest so far. We're pretty close. Mark, I'll just give a shout out, does all of the, like, editing, all of the kind of sound engineering stuff. So we're really kind of doing this in house. And when I say we, I mean Mark. Um, we have, uh, a former admissions officer and friend who composes our music. So that's really handy.
[00:24:20] Mark Dunn: Really nice thing.
[00:24:21] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah.
[00:24:22] Mark Dunn: Also on Yale's payroll because he still does some reading for the office, which makes it just all that much easier to get very quick sound added and him paid. And I realized that's a luxury most people don't have.
[00:24:34] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yes.
[00:24:35] Mark Dunn: It's like very much like just a perk of being around a place like Yale is just like, you know, super talented people who can do stuff like this. It's great.
[00:24:41] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah.
[00:24:41] Mark Dunn: I'll mention, you know, we, it's a pretty light setup. I mean, I think I honestly Googled like three-person podcast setup when I was interested in this, we do everything off of Adobe Audition. I do very simple edits to take out ums and, you know, takes and stuff like that. Our boss likes to listen to the episode before we go live.
[00:25:00] Hannah Mendlowitz: Mm-Hmm.
[00:25:00] Mark Dunn: But, uh, credit to him, he almost never has any edits. You know, we've worked with him long enough that we all are pretty much on the same page.
[00:25:06] Hannah Mendlowitz: Mm-Hmm.
[00:25:07] Mark Dunn: For how we want to convey things. And then yeah, we broadcast, technically through something called the Yale Podcast Network. There's someone who works in Yale's broadcast media studio, who I simply share our MP3 files with, and he gets them uploaded to the RSS feeds and all that.
[00:25:20] So yeah, it's surprisingly straightforward. And I will say that I have found that a little goes a long way in terms of production quality, like having a decent mic, doing a minimum amount of editing, having a little music and like thinking about just planning ahead to sketch out our episodes where we, when we're writing them. So we don't work off of a script, but we work out a kind of a sketch with a clear sort of beginning, middle end, talking points, sometimes Roman numeral kind of things. And I find that really helps to deliver product that is pretty coherent.
[00:25:56] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yup.
[00:25:56] Mark Dunn: And, uh, you get the points across that we want to without us kind of sounding like we're stammering on the air.
[00:26:02] Hannah Mendlowitz: Right.
[00:26:02] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: You're speaking my language right now Mark, you said all of my favorite things. Editing, prep, proper sound equipment, this is great. And uh, you guys do have a great network we did an interview, and this is how we found you guys, someone else from Yale a while back, we interviewed the Yale University Press. So, you know, Yale has so many great resources and I really want you guys to create, I think it needs its own podcast, not to add more onto you, but I really think you could just do one podcast for athletic admissions.
[00:26:32] I'm not athletic at all, but I feel like that'd be fascinating. And like drama filled because getting your kid into sports is just a whole new level. So thank you guys. I'm going to put the buggy ears. Maybe there, we'll be interviewing you about that podcast next, but thank you guys so much, um, for coming by today and not sharing your knowledge. Now I feel like I can apply to Yale after talking to you.
[00:26:55] Mark Dunn: All right. Good.
[00:26:56] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: Love that. Yeah.
[00:26:58] Mark Dunn: Well, thanks for having us. This was great fun.
[00:27:00] Hannah Mendlowitz: Yeah. Thank you so much.
[00:27:03] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: I really thought this was a very different conversation for us, uh, compared to some of the other podcasts that we have interviewed in the past. This is really neat to really focus on something that was very niche, like the admissions process and realize that this is something that all schools really should be doing and really any type of organization as well. Kind of giving a peek behind the curtain, I think makes you more humanized. It gives your information out there.
[00:27:29] And as I said, it's kind of like the new press release because you don't have to make the media people dig for all those little bits of gold when they're cutting up their radio or TV interview.
[00:27:39] Neil McPhedran: Yeah, totally agree, Jen. I think this is, to me, this is the exact conversation of why we're doing our podcast, Continuing Studies. It's for other folks in higher education to learn from their colleagues in other schools. And my main takeaway from this conversation is, we said it in, you know, when we were chatting, but every admission office should do something like this. Like to me, this was a classic example of why we're doing Continuing Studies podcasts.
[00:28:09] And I really enjoyed the conversation. I really liked at one point when the phone was ringing in the background. I'm not sure if we'll edit that out, but I don't think we can. But that was hilarious. I was like, it was like Greg, our producer, he typed it in our chat channel, that was a parent calling, and because this is sort of in the final throes of admin, of the admin process time of year. So, but I thought that was great too.
[00:28:31] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: I didn't know what he was talking about. I didn't know that there was a phone going.
[00:28:36] Neil McPhedran: Yeah, the phone was ringing, and Hannah was like, looking off into the distance, kind of like going like, someone answer the phone. It's great.
[00:28:43] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: Awesome. Should be on our blooper page.
[00:28:46] Neil McPhedran: That's right.
[00:28:47] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: Another great one. I feel like now that we should be, uh, looking for all the Ivy League schools admissions and see if they have a podcast to kids, and I feel like we'll know how to get into all of them.
[00:28:56] Neil McPhedran: That's right. We definitely will Jen. Okay. Well, that's a wrap. Thanks for joining us and tune in next time.
[00:29:03] Jennifer-Lee Gunson: Bye.
[00:29:04] Neil McPhedran: Bye bye.
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