Continuing Studies: Higher Ed Podcasting

Dee Patel: We wanna meet people
where they are, and how do we do that

without taking the brand, without
stomping on the brand, with still

giving the credibility to the brand.

So it's how can podcasts lean into the
Wharton School brand and how can Wharton

School brand lean into podcasting?

And I always say podcast
is sort of a treat for your

ears when your eyes are busy.

Neil McPhedran: Welcome to Continuing
Studies, a podcast for higher education

podcasters to learn and get inspired.

I'm Neil McPhedran, founder of Podium
Podcast Company and Higher Ed Pods.

Jennifer-Lee: And I'm Jennifer-Lee,
the founder of JPod Creations,

podcasting is broadcasting.

And we want you to know you're not alone.

In fact, there are many of you
higher ed podcasters out there, and

we can all learn from each other.

Neil McPhedran: Speaking of learning from
each other, Jen, we had a really exciting

conversation with the team organizing
Higher Ed PodCon, and we're moving to a

two day versus one day we had in year one,
so we're moving to a two day and we're

expecting to have a lot more people there.

We're talking about the tracks
of what we're gonna focus on

for all of the sessions, all
the panel and speaker sessions.

So it's pretty exciting to start
to think about it and expanding

what we're gonna talk about.

I think one of the things this year that
we didn't do in year one is we're gonna

have more content for higher ed folks
that are just getting into podcasting.

So I think that'll be really interesting.

We're trying to infuse more beginner just
getting started content for year two.

Jennifer-Lee: Which is great because we
learnt from our next guest, Dee Patel,

that it's not that easy to start a podcast
and then eventually start a network.

Neil McPhedran: That's right.

Good segue, Jen.

In this episode, we are chatting with
Dee Patel, who is the Director of

Content at Wharton in the Marketing
and Communications department.

And she has just launched the
Knowledge at Wharton Podcast Network.

So I think what's really interesting
is, as we know, Wharton has a very

robust business journal, and so as
part of the business journal there is

a lot of, there's their website and a
lot of other content that they produce.

They originally had a
SiriusXM radio station.

And that's no longer in existence,
but they have spun out two radio shows

into podcasts, and we're gonna get into
this, all about the larger network that

they have actually built, this larger
podcast network, that lives under

the Knowledge at Wharton umbrella.

So I'm excited to get into this
conversation and Dee is a former

broadcaster, so we definitely had
some fun stuff there, didn't we, Jen?

Jennifer-Lee: I love former broadcasters,
but it's interesting with that SiriusXM

thing, because she is a former traditional
broadcaster, it doesn't seem that easy

to move something like that over to a
podcast and is a little bit complicated.

But we'll find out what they did
and what their expectations for when

they moved it from XM to podcasting.

Neil McPhedran: That's great.

Let's get into it.

Welcome, Dee.

It's so great to have you
here on Continuing Studies.

Dee Patel: Oh, thank you both.

Really great to be here.

Hi Jen.

Hi Neil.

Thank you for having me on the podcast.

Jennifer-Lee: Yeah, Dee is another
one that we met in Chicago.

You and I met early in the morning.

We kinda just like bumped into each other
over the pastries and the coffee, and then

I introduced you to Neil and obviously
we bonded over my favorite topic, which

Neil knows 'cause I mention it all the
time on this podcast, but broadcasting.

Because Dee actually worked for CBS
at one point and I was like, oh,

that was like one of my like bucket
list items was to work for CBS.

So I was like, love it,
broadcaster connection.

Dee Patel: Yeah, absolutely.

We definitely bonded on that and
it was like high octane energy.

I just saw somebody coming at
me, Jen, you probably just saw

a lot of hair coming at you.

We just instantly bonded and it
was so lovely to meet a fellow

broadcaster who is now in podcasting.

Uh, it's almost like a natural transition.

Not sure if people realize
that, that that's where sort

of podcasting originated from.

So Jen and I just kind of
geeked out a little bit next

to the pastries about that.

Um, but it's okay.

Jennifer-Lee: Neil was
actually looking for you.

He was like, we've been chatting
with someone from Wharton.

He's like, I need to know who this is.

And then I coincidentally, I was talking
to you and then I was like, hey, Neil.

You're like, oh, I was trying to find her.

So, brought you guys together.

Dee Patel: Yeah.

That's awesome.

I didn't know that I was slightly popular
and I think, Jen, you made me popular.

And then Neil was like,
I was looking for you.

I was like, oh no, what did I do?

I was like, I hope I'm not in trouble.

Neil McPhedran: That's great.

So Dee, we've got you here today 'cause
we would like to chat with you about the

podcast network that you have been busy
building at Wharton, and that's part of

the Knowledge at Wharton whole platform.

So Knowledge at Wharton that's
been around for a while, right?

Like that's like a magazine and an email.

And if I have it correctly, at
one point in time it might have

even been a SiriusXM radio show.

Maybe we could just sort of start there
and just give us a little bit of an

insight into what Knowledge at Wharton is.

Dee Patel: Absolutely.

You're absolutely correct
on all of the above.

Knowledge of Wharton is an institutional
brand at Wharton disseminating content.

It's a website, disseminates
faculty research.

It's also a newsletter.

It used to be a show on SiriusXM.

Predates me.

But that is a brand that has
such deep roots at Wharton and

credibility and the reliability.

So yes, absolutely, it's the anchor that
we are building the podcast network upon.

We kind of went back and forth a
little bit like, should we call it the

Knowledge of Wharton Podcast Network?

Should we call it Wharton Podcast Network?

We decided we landed on Wharton
Podcast Network 'cause if we want

this to grow, and it will probably
grow, it is faculty oriented,

faculty based research surrounding
anything that has to do with faculty.

Whether we are interviewing them, they're
interviewing each other, or they're

interviewing industry experts, we may
wanna expand it one day to students.

So we decided, let's call it the
Wharton Podcast Network lives in

houses itself, mainly like its
main house is, Knowledge of Wharton

website, that's its landing page.

So you know, it obviously
is on Apple, it's on Acast,

wherever you find your podcast.

So it is everywhere.

But that is where it is.

And that's sort of the, where
the strategy comes from.

We set out to build this,
it was a lot of research.

We're certainly not the
first ones to do this, right?

We're absolutely honest about that.

But what we wanted to do is play in
this space that has grown exponentially

probably within the last five years.

Neil McPhedran: Yeah.

Dee Patel: If I could even throw some
statistics at you, but as of this year,

there's approximately almost little
over 4.5 million podcasts worldwide,

and we're talking active ones, you know,
which creates a massive opportunity

for quality content to stand out.

And the number of podcast listeners,
a little over 500 million in 2025.

That's expected to grow to
over 600 million by 2027.

So we wanted to really play in this
space, but like how do we do that

with all of these podcasts out there?

Like why would somebody want to come to
our podcast as opposed to the others?

Neil McPhedran: I love that you
have given us some knowledge, but

it's obvious that it wasn't just a
decision, hey, let's do a podcast.

Let's do a podcast network.

But you've anchored it in data,
observations of opportunity, where

to take Knowledge at Wharton next.

If you go to the Knowledge at
Wharton website, podcasts is a

main thing in the navigation.

So it's obvious to me that this
is a main channel, podcasting,

for Knowledge at Wharton.

You've anchored it in, obviously
you've done some research and

there was some real deliberate
conversations and discussions on your

end to really lean into podcasting.

Curious kind of about that.

Was there sort of anything you
can share there just about the

process to get to that decision, or
was it just kind of a no brainer?

We need to go into podcasting more.

Dee Patel: No, I mean the process
was, when you're in the process,

it's exhaustive and then you
look back at the process, you're

like, oh, that was amazing.

That was fun.

We anchored it in, we don't do
anything here without research.

So we research, research, research,
and then we come up with a

strategy based on that research.

And you know, what we
do is very subjective.

It's not math or science.

So two plus two does not always
equal four for us because some people

may like this or not like that.

My supervisors and those that sit
in chairs higher, are like, Dee

put, put a stake in the ground
and just stick to it, right?

And give you a rationale as to why.

So I've had a lot of support along the
way and sure, being Wharton, there is

funding, but it wasn't like a blank check.

It was, let's try to do this on a
budget that seems reasonable and so

that we can see if it works because
we don't know if it's going to work.

We don't know if there's
going to be receptiveness.

We don't know if people
are going to be listening.

We don't know how it's gonna be received
by faculty, which in academia, faculty

governs academia, so we don't know that.

But what we realized in the research is
that we wanna meet people where they are.

How are people consuming information now?

Knowledge at Wharton was strictly based
on written content, digital content.

We certainly don't want to replace
that, but we want to supplement that.

And how do we do that without taking the
brand, without stomping on the brand, with

still giving the credibility to the brand.

So it's how can podcasts lean into the
Wharton School brand and how can Wharton

School brave lean into podcasting?

And I always say podcasting
is sort of a treat for your

ears when your eyes are busy.

And so we started the podcasting.

Jennifer-Lee: You know, I have a lot
of discussions about this because

traditional media, and you know, this
is, like when you have a company or

an institution like Wharton and you're
trying to create your own narrative,

you're trying to get, press is very
difficult sometimes on traditional media.

And especially now where it's more paid to
play than ever, than having that authentic

press release that gets on someone's desk.

Now, I tell people, your podcast is kind
of like your own media platform where

you're controlling your narrative and you
are putting your brand out there on their

awareness and you're creating your own
station to broadcast your message out.

Dee Patel: Absolutely.

I completely agree with that, and
I think that is a space where, you

know, we need to make sure, like
our podcasting is informational,

educational, and entertaining.

'Cause it's not really those three
things I don't know that it would

be able to play in this space.

So when we first started this, it
was, we had one podcast, so we call

it our flagship show, which is the
Ripple Effect, and that was something

that was just started from scratch.

It was an idea that came from our dean's
initiative to elevate faculty research.

These faculty are doing great research,
amazing, incredibly intelligent,

but who is reading the 25 page plus
papers that these research come in?

Like, how do we do this?

We can do it in a story.

We've been doing it in this
story wise, but are we really

getting their research out there?

And as part of the marketing and
communications department, literally

in my job description is to help
faculty market themselves and help

get the research out there and why
somebody wanna come to Wharton, right?

So we started the podcast Ripple Effect,
which is elevating faculty research,

and it's about 20 minutes long.

It's a weekly show.

We put some funding behind it
and created a studio where we

record these podcasts in person.

And I do feel like an in-person podcast,
you can sort of vibe off that energy.

So it does have a different energetic
feel to it when it's in person,

but we can certainly now do things
remotely as we're doing here.

That podcast started off, difficult
to schedule faculty, right?

Trying to get people at the same time
in the same place nowadays, everybody

being so busy, that's a tall order.

It's not difficult, just a tall order.

It's just a lot of back and forth happens.

So, and then also, you know,
maybe reluctance to be on,

well, what is a podcast?

So what I did was, you know, just
made sure that I had kept up with the

consistency of it, made sure the content
was something that was Wharton forward,

so that we were being very honest
with their research and we were taking

great care with their research as well.

And having that commitment
to do it weekly.

And know in my back of my mind
that if I do this consistently

the audience will grow.

If I do this correctly and provide
great content, at the end of the

day, great content is great content.

You can put glitter around it, you
can jazz it up, but people have

the ability to X out of a content
more easily than ever before.

So those things will win out.

But that's a slow and steady race.

This is not a overnight success business.

And so when we did that for like a
year and then we realized that faculty

were coming to us saying, hey, we would
love to be on Ripple Effect, the tables

turned a little bit and that was great.

That's what I would hope that would've
happened would measure success.

And so now with the podcast network,
we have been receiving inquiries and

saying, hey, I would like to do a podcast.

When can I do a podcast?

I would like to do a podcast.

And, which is amazing.

And again, we did research.

I made documents.

Sort of a gateway of like, okay.

Yes, you wanna do a podcast?

It's not as easy as it looks.

Everybody thinks it's easy, right?

Everybody here on this call knows
it's not as easy as it looks.

And there's research behind it.

There's scripting, there's the technical
aspects of it, and then you take this

content that you record, and now what?

What do you do with it?

So I said, okay, here's
my three Cs for a podcast.

Like more than 90% of podcasts
fail after episode three.

Neil McPhedran: Right.

Dee Patel: That's hard to imagine.

'Cause you're like, really three?

Like that's not a lot.

I get it.

It's not, but after three
episodes, most people find out

they can't provide enough content.

So that's one C. Is there enough content?

Is the content good?

Are you able to even,
you know, provide that?

The commitment, yeah, I can do it.

I did it for three Tuesdays in a
row, but like the fourth Tuesday,

I gotta, I gotta go somewhere.

I gotta do something, I can't do it.

And then there's that commitment to it.

Like, are you committed
to see this through?

Even if you know, you're not seeing
like millions of listeners right

away, which I doubt that you will.

So those are the three C's.

Can we do this?

And it is my job as a person who heads up
the Wharton podcast network to see like

does this person who is coming to me and
say, I wanna do a podcast, that's awesome.

The interest is there.

I get it.

Is there content, enough
content that we can do?

When I help them think that
out, can they commit to this?

And I really present the
realities of that to them.

This is a commitment it's going to take.

I need you here on a consistent basis.

And then can you commit to this?

'Cause you're not gonna see the results
right away, but can you commit to what

you are doing, what this concept is?

It's not just sitting in front
of your laptop or a microphone

and just talking, because that
goes away after three episodes.

Neil McPhedran: Yeah.

Sorry, what was the third C?

So it was content, commitment, and?

Dee Patel: Consistency.

Neil McPhedran: Consistency, right.

Oh, I like those.

The three Cs.

Jennifer-Lee: I just like that you're
setting the expectations, because I

think nowadays everyone wants to, for
gratification, especially with the younger

demo, and so it's like, no, you gotta
commit to this and you gotta grow it.

Because that's the thing, even in
broadcasting, it's like you're not

gonna just start talking on the mic
and your ratings are gonna go to number

one and everyone's gonna sponsor you.

That's not realistic.

Takes time.

Neil McPhedran: Yeah, I,
I also like your approach.

You started with the Ripple Effect.

You applied your three C's.

That commitment and consistency then
opened up the door for faculty to go

like, oh, I see what you're doing.

Oh, I wanna be on that.

Oh, I see my colleagues are on that.

I have great research that I want
to have amplified as well, versus

we're gonna launch a podcast network.

And why don't you all chime in
and tell us what we're gonna do.

Like I think that was a really
interesting path that you took there.

Start with the one, get the faculty
on board, and now they're on board.

And as you said, you flipped the script
there and now they're coming to you.

Jennifer-Lee: And I love the
fact that, yeah, you guard it.

I don't think we vet enough in the
podcasting space, and maybe it's

because it's super young still, but
I like the fact that you're vetting

it because I think it does create
better have to quality in the end.

Dee, did this role exist before you got
there or did this role kind of happen

when you got there and you're like, we're
doing all this because of my background.

Neil McPhedran: Good question.

Dee Patel: My role as it is, was
newly created based upon a need

as the Director of Content for
Wharton Marketing Communications.

And then all of a sudden it's like, yes,
I have a background in this broadcasting,

so obviously please utilize me, right?

And so it kind of grew into that one
podcast and I came in and said, okay, yes.

The way we, you know, in broadcasting,
if it's not a streamlined

process, it just doesn't work.

If it takes 12 people to do one
thing, it's not going to work.

So like we can streamline this process and
make it work like a well-oiled machine.

And so kind of doing that with one,
you create a formula for the others.

Neil McPhedran: Right.

Dee Patel: With a different
concept, different topic.

Sure.

Maybe it's a different host where
it's like the Ripple is one host

talking to a faculty, you know, just
a faculty as well, and then you can

grow that to something different.

And so it wasn't, I wasn't
initially brought on for podcasting.

It just grew as the need for podcasting
grew, as the popularity for podcasting

grew, as the audience dictated how
they want to receive information.

And so now we're meeting them
where they are and ability to

sort of shift resources as well.

'Cause we did not just
hire 10 people for this.

Barry, myself.

We, I have a audio producer.

I have a showrunner.

I have a video content senior producer who
does other things, be on podcasting and

podcasting was in addition to the role.

So those are the four that
sort of fall under a purview.

Pretty low lift there for at
least as far as resources, but

it's also to see if this works.

And we have five and I'm
like, okay, now it's five.

I am already getting requests for more.

I think I received, once we launched
it, we put podcast episodes on our

platforms before we did the official
launch, so to speak, because we wanted

to provide content when we actually
said, send people to go to the

place that we're sending them to go.

Saying, Hey, we have a podcast network.

If they only see one show, like
they're not much of a network.

Neil McPhedran: So there's five shows
now that are part of the network.

So the Ripple Effect was the first
one and now there's Where AI Works.

There's a, This Week in Business podcast,
Marketing Matters, and Moneyball podcast.

So those other four, those are fairly
new shows then is, is that correct?

Dee Patel: So, yeah, Ripple is our
flagship show, sort of our, you know, kind

of like our baby, but our other flagship
show is also This Week in Business.

It's what happened when I said,
okay, how do we play in this space

of, we are in a very unique time at
the moment where mainstream media

may not be trusted at the moment.

Or the credibility of it has
decreased just because of the way

the world is and what's happening
in the world at the moment.

Regardless of your political
views, it just has gone down.

And so if I am looking at my
retirement fund, 401k, it is

fluctuating, it has fluctuated up
and down in the last year or so.

Who do I go to to say, why is
it doing that and what do I do?

Who do I trust for that?

Like why my 401k might be fluctuating?

Yeah, you know what?

I might trust a Wharton professor
whose research is based on quantitative

facts to tell me why it is.

Now, to be clear, they're not
providing financial advice.

They're just telling you why it is
doing what it's doing based on their

research that they have been doing.

I feel like that is
trustworthy at the moment.

So it's like there's
a momentum train here.

We need to hop on it and get the
research out there for the professors.

So we created a This Week in Business,
which is current events, trending events,

that Wharton professors can talk about.

So it's moves very fast.

It's short turnaround, it's twice a week
and it's almost modeled after New York

Times, The Daily, but it's not daily.

Also, it's not just that podcast, but we
use that podcast and whatever story that

was for that day, and we turn it into a
story for Knowledge at Wharton as well.

So optimize the content into the
different platforms that we own.

Neil McPhedran: That's great.

So there's the five Wharton podcast
network shows, and then there's

other podcasts from across Wharton.

Dee Patel: Yep.

Ripple effect.

And This Week in Business are kind of
like our flagships that we've create,

totally own from the ground up.

And then the other two shows,
Moneyball and Marketing Matters,

they were what I call the legacy
shows that came over from Sirius XM.

Neil McPhedran: Right.

Dee Patel: And they were the shows that
had the following, had the audience,

and had sort of that niche that we were
not doing in the other two podcasts.

So sports analytics and marketing.

And really just had a really good
vibe to them and the chemistry

to them, and also provided those
three Cs that we talked about.

So we had that.

And they are faculty hosted podcasts.

Moneyball has four hosts and they
have a guest come on every week.

Marketing Matters has two faculty hosts
and has a guest come on every week.

Where AI Works is a analytics AI
professor, and we pick a different

one each season, so to speak, A
different professor to host these

depending on their research, and
they interview industry experts as to

how AI is working in your industry.

Neil McPhedran: And then there's
others what that are featured, right?

Dee Patel: So yeah, there's the Wharton
Podcast Network, that's the five.

And then the ones at the bottom
you'll see are others from across

Wharton are the ones that, you know,
there's nothing that stops faculty

from just doing it themselves or
if they want to fund it themselves.

The Adam Grant one has been around
longer than the podcast network has.

So they're the ones that they own
that they produce, but they also

have that consistency, the content,
and leans into the Wharton brand.

So we help amplify that
podcast on our page as well.

Neil McPhedran: Right, and some of
those ones in that network have other

affiliations, like there's one in
there that's part of the Freakonomics

radio and the Adam Grant one is part
of the TED network, and we actually

helped launch All Else Equal when it
was just with the GSB at the time.

I know that they moved it over to be part
of Wharton versus Stanford at the time, so

yeah, that's great to see it in there too.

And then, because we're talking
to podcasters here, let just get

a little into the weeds a bit.

How does each show kind of support
each other and or the network?

So do you have call outs
to the podcast network?

So if I just come across Marketing
Matters, for example, will they

promote the network and other shows?

Is there drive back to this
great resource, this great

website that you've created?

Dee Patel: Yeah, great question.

And all part of the strategy.

So when I put together the strategy
before we launched the network, I

said, part of what we can provide them
is this cross promotional strategy

because like we're owners of them,
we're owners of these podcasts now.

And so if like, let's say a Marketing
Matters host is on Ripple Effect,

or on This Week in Business,
not as a host, but as a guest,

that's a cross promotion there.

And how do we, you know, proactively
do this, but we have them, we

strategically have them on either once
a month or once a quarter too, one,

talk about their research in something
that might be going on in the world

or in a Ripple Effect topic theme.

And then we organically sort of
promote their show and said, and hey,

if you like what you're hearing about
somebody talking about, you know, retail

inflation, you can hear more about
it in this X, Y, Z podcast as well.

And so we have another channel where
we put in one podcast a month that

is a channel that is sort of a legacy
channel from the XM days, but it's a

Knowledge of Wharton eight cast channel.

So it has years, 16 years
of audience build up.

Neil McPhedran: They'll have
all kinds of followers across

Apple, Spotify, et cetera.

That's a smart, yeah.

Dee Patel: We want to provide content to
them because the followers already there.

We don't want them to go away.

But they may not know about the five
podcasts that are in the network.

So we put a episode a month into that.

So that was part, again,
part of the strategy.

'Cause once a wheel start going in
motion and there's no strategy in place,

you're just like, oh wait, what do I do?

But I kind of outlined
what we were going to do.

And we can certainly
pivot from that, right?

We can pivot from it.

But if you get it down on paper, it
kind of makes it easier to pivot 'cause

you know what you're pivoting from.

And then if we have events, like we
had a sports summit, AI Sports Summit

just this past week, and I brought in
a speaker from that summit to be on

Moneyball, which is a sports podcast,
and which increased the attendance.

So like if all things work and
hopefully increase the listenership

of the podcast, I don't have those
metrics yet, but hopefully that's

what the cross promotion strategy is.

So that we can all play in this
space, but also help each other out.

The faculty have been very receptive
in doing all of these things, so

that has been good on my end, I have
not received any pushback on that.

Jennifer-Lee: I love that you're
leveraging the audiences of the

other podcasts that you have,
because I think that's what a lot

of people don't necessarily do.

I always tell people, if you're a
podcast for a business, but you have

friends in the similar space and
they've got podcasts that have a

significant listen, do cross promos.

But everyone sometimes is
a little scared to do that.

So I like the fact that you
guys are able to do that.

Obviously you do have a
bit of a team behind you.

When Neil and I do talk to other
institutions, sometimes it's just one

person and it's an extra job on their
desk that they're doing all this.

What would be your advice to people
that maybe wanna approach their

institution to garner resources and
other people to help them grow a

podcast network or just a few podcasts?

Dee Patel: I think it is really
deciding, and regardless of the

resources that I do have and seem
to have, they're still limited.

And also bandwidth is limited, right?

Like hours in the day are limited and,

Neil McPhedran: Yeah, and
they're not all yours.

Like that video editor
for example you mentioned.

That they've got a whole bunch of
other stuff they're probably doing.

Dee Patel: Absolutely.

Absolutely.

We're doing one in person, so I
gotta pull 'em off of something.

One would think five podcasts
is somebody's full job.

I have a whole other set of
things that I am required to

do, but I honestly enjoy this.

Regardless of whether it seems like you
have the entire Wharton school behind

you, or very limited resources with one
person, it's deciding where to put your

resources, where do you wanna put these?

Do you wanna create a amazing studio
space, but you're not gonna have

the bandwidth of the resources
to fill that studio space, right?

Or do you want to do it in
going after the A-list guests?

'Cause that requires a X amount of
bandwidth, or should you go after,

maybe at first the B team of guests
and then build up your reputation?

So that you can get through the
firewalls of the gatekeepers that

the A-lister guests come with.

Like it's usually you can get them, great.

It's their PR people that you
have to go through that is the

hardest and it's the tallest order.

So those that are just starting off,
you know, my great advice would kind of

come back to just really the three Cs.

Like what kind of content are
you trying to provide and what

is the competition out there?

What, you know, how
can you commit to this?

Like what is your
commitment level to this?

Are you trying to do this every week
or are you trying to do this every day?

Or are you trying to do this every month?

The audience will get used to whatever
consistency you give it, and the

audience anticipates that consistency
and better show up when you say

you're going to show up for them.

And then really just kind of
trust the process a little bit.

It's hard work, like nothing,
this is not an overnight business.

This is not something that you can
just kind of be like, oh, I can just

sit in front of a microphone and talk.

I mean, as a broadcaster, sure,
we are trained to do that.

Like Jen and I will tell you we're
trained to do that, but even we know

that unless you come to the microphone
with a script it doesn't work.

Script out.

Script out your intro.

Script out your segment.

Script out your,

Jennifer-Lee: Be prepared.

Dee Patel: Yes, be prepared.

The best people that make it look easy did
so much preparation just to make it look

like I just came in and talked for this.

Even for myself to come on this podcast.

I asked for some questions that you
might be asking, and then I wrote out

some bullet points I have up here on
my screen, some of those statistics,

the podcast page that you were
referring to so that I can make sure

we're both looking at the same thing.

You know, you're really wanting
to respect somebody's time.

And also what are you building?

Are you like, are you building a brand?

Are you building reputation?

Are you coveting those things?

Are you building a, a community?

And I think that's what the Wharton
Podcast Network was doing, is building

a community, whether that is a community
of relationships between myself, Wharton

mark comp, and the faculty, which then
ripples into the relationship that faculty

will build with the industry experts.

And then whether that domino effects
into the relationship that students,

prospective students, current students
alum have when they're watching,

listening to these podcasts saying
like, oh, I may want to go here.

I may wanna take this class.

I may want to have this professor.

Or, hey, I'm an alumni.

I may want to donate back to the school.

So it kind of almost like
a full circle of community.

Neil McPhedran: That's great.

Jen and I have joked about this, and
any of our listeners have probably

heard us talk about this, but we
have introduced fellow podcasters at

the same institutions to each other.

I think there's just something, I feel
like there's so much opportunity for

podcasters in a, in a school, in a
institution, just to start collaborating.

And back to your question
there, Jen, about resources.

You can kind of start to
pool together resources.

I think if someone could put up
their hand, take the reins, there's

probably a lot of opportunity for
that because I think the others that

are out there in the other corners of
the institution, podcasting, they're

yearning for the collaboration.

At least that's what we've
seen over and over again.

And so it's just a matter of getting
everyone together and then collaborating

and sharing those resources.

Like that's also something
we've heard so much.

Your example where you've got your roles.

None of those people, that's their
full-time gig, but it's like you

build it, they will come almost.

You've built this thing.

Now you've got interest.

You've got people that are doing
other things, but they're working

with you and it just kind of like
feeds off of each other as you go.

I have one more question for you.

I'm sure Jen has one too, but I noticed
that in the Where AI Works, that's

in collaboration with Accenture.

How does that come about?

So did you like they're
a sponsor for that show?

Dee Patel: That's exactly what it is.

So we were able to build it out
and say, hey, you know, AI is a

hot topic at the moment, right?

Everybody wants to be part of
anything artificial intelligence, and

we attach AI Wharton to that name.

Now it gives trustworthiness
of what they might be saying.

And because it's Where AI Works, that's
sort of like, we wanna make sure, like

if we're having that faculty talk about
how AI is showing up in the workplace.

I think there were many
sponsors on the line there.

And so we went with Accenture because I
think gave us the best partnership and

collaboration and helping us provide the
industry experts that are on these shows.

There's a little bit of say in it
because it's a sponsorship, but at

the end of the day, we wanna make sure
that it has the Wharton brand behind

it, and it is, make sure it's in line
with the Wharton messaging and what

Wharton is at the end of the day.

So it's an advertisement, but it's
more sponsorship to help get the word

out about what AI is doing and how
it's showing up in the workplace.

And so they provide the
industry experts for that.

So all different podcasts
are all very, very different.

I seem to kind of live and breed
them, so I just kind of know.

But like now I realize as I go to
explain these podcasts to somebody else,

like yeah, they are quite different.

Like some of them are in person only.

Like Ripples, we try to
do that in person only.

This Week in Business is twice a week,
and it's a very short turnaround.

Where AI Works has a
sponsorship attached to it.

So there's a different caveat to it.

Moneyball and Marketing Matters.

Yeah, they're the legacy shows
that came over from XM, but

they're under our umbrella now.

They're both very different,
even though I categorized them in

sort of the legacy shows of XM.

For Marketing Matters, we had
almost all the guests planned

out until about December.

Everybody is motivated differently
and each of the podcasts are

motivated very differently.

I try to make sure that I
give them the treatment as

strategically as they possibly can.

Just cater to the needs of
each individual podcast.

Jennifer-Lee: I love it.

With Moneyball and Marketing
Matters, they came from XM, obviously

that is satellite radio station.

And did you find it hard to carry
the audience over towards Wharton

and it on now being on like Spotify
and Apple and the hosting platform?

Dee Patel: So I, we never knew the numbers
of what their listenership was when

they're on air, and we just kind of hosted
them in the other podcast realm before.

So it was like, if we're bringing them
over to us and under the podcast network

umbrella, what can we provide them?

One is metrics, which is something that
you know was not provided to them before.

But two is that cohesive branding.

And if you look at like the podcast
page, they all kind of look like

they go together, like their
logos and episode art is the same.

You know, the look of something
kind of matters as well.

And then what we really wanted
to provide them was like, how

people are engaging with it.

Because like, no, they were not, you know,
there was not engagement with the show.

So social media.

Our social media team provides
really great engagement by providing

every episode a video on YouTube.

All of the audio episodes, obviously
on the podcast platforms, but

also a social media clip from
at least one episode a month.

And then we have a, when we launched
the podcast network, we launched a

Wharton podcast newsletter that is
all about just podcasting as well.

So, so we're able to get the
word out a little bit more.

We want it to be realistic and
set expectations that all of that

audience that might have been
listening to you on XM is not

gonna come over and listen to you.

But there might be some that would just
look for you, but to have that expectation

saying that we're gonna steal the audience
from XM, that's just not the reality

and that's not how broadcasting works.

You know, people love their platform.

Even right now, like we all have a
platform that we listen to, we all have

a station that we view or listen to.

No matter what that station does
or what another station does, I'm

probably not gonna change my habits.

So it's like, how do you create
something for those people?

There are, there's this audience out
here that doesn't have a habit yet.

That's who you grab.

Jennifer-Lee: That's so interesting
because that's, people might

be like, oh, they're so lucky.

They took these big shows off of Sirius
and then they instantly got everybody.

But no, that's not how it works.

And you gotta be prepared.

So it takes a lot of time and thought,
and probably it's beneficial now, but

it's not gonna be an instant success.

Dee Patel: A lot of
conversations, lot of buy-ins.

And you know, as Jen, and I know I'm
broadcasting, it's like almost very

quick decisions, but something that I had
to get used to sort of in the academic

world is a lot of red tape, lot of
round and round, lot of re-conversating

about something I just conversated about
and I thought we decided on yesterday.

Yet we're talking about it
again, but it does work.

We had an audience for
about X amount of years.

What we were able to use from that was
not really their listeners or their

audience, but the fact that they built
this reputation for that many years

and all of those guests were on there.

So we were able to say, Hey, we
had CMO of, I don't know, Yahoo or

this or that on our show, and we're
reaching out to you to be on the show.

You know, people tend to wanna, like
the CMO of DoorDash would more likely

to be on our show if they knew that
somebody from Yahoo was on there as well.

We were able to carry that reputation
over, which helped us build it out on

our end, but we were not delusional
to think that those listeners

would come over on the podcast end.

Neil McPhedran: Yeah.

Well, you have been very busy,
Dee, and I commend you on your

progress and what you've built.

It's really exciting to see and I
think that there's a lot here that

you've shared with us and our audience
that we've learned from, so really

appreciate you joining us today.

I'm excited to see how the
network grows and what's next.

Dee Patel: Thank you, all three of
you, for having me on this podcast.

I really enjoyed the conversation.

Something I forgot to say in the
podcast is like, podcast should

feel like you're eavesdropping on
a conversation, like just friends

talking and you're eavesdropping on it.

And you know, hopefully
people felt like that here.

Like the comfortability
level was definitely there.

Neil McPhedran: Great.

Well thank you.

Jennifer-Lee: Thank you.

Neil McPhedran: Well, Jen, that was great.

Another great conversation.

I really enjoyed getting into the nitty
gritty of building a podcast network.

I learned a lot.

I think networks are such a
big opportunity for podcasting

at the university level.

It was great to hear
all that went into it.

It wasn't just a whimsical thing.

There was a lot of intention and
planning, and there's a lot more

plans moving forward as they move
from phase one into phase two.

Jennifer-Lee: And the fact that we
mentioned earlier that she is a former

broadcaster coming from CBS, and so
that is a huge traditional network and

now it's neat to see that people like
her and other universities and colleges

that we have talked to are creating
their own networks and kind of putting

their narrative in their own hand and
creating their own media companies.

Neil McPhedran: Yeah, that's a great
way to look at it too, from a network

perspective where by networking a
number of podcasts, you are, in a

sense, as you're saying, creating
this bigger channel almost, right?

So, yeah, that's a good point, Jen.

Jennifer-Lee: Yeah, we're moving
from traditional networks.

They're still gonna be
around, but they're, they're

just looking very different.

We're in like the future.

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